Neuvation R 28 SL 2

<body topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 marginheight=0 marginwidth=0> <table cellpadding=0 cellspacing=0 border=0><tr> <td valign="top" colspan=2 height=90 BGCOLOR="#000000" TEXT="#F7F7FF" background="005b85a3.jpg"> <div> <FONT SIZE="5" COLOR="#FFFFFF" FACE="Arial" ><B>Big Ring Adventure Team</B></FONT><B>    </B><B> |     </B><A HREF="index.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Big Ring Adventure Team"><B>home</B></A></div> <div> <A HREF="black_spire_bash_guard.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Black Spire Bash Guard">Black Spire Bash Guard</A>   |   <A HREF="speed_king.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Continental Speed King MTB Tires">Continental Speed King MTB Tires</A>   |   <A HREF="garmin_edge_305.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Garmin Edge 305">Garmin Edge 305</A>   |   <A HREF="managing_book.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="IMBAs Managing Mountain Biking Book">IMBA's Managing Mountain Biking Book</A>   |   <A HREF="ink_well_tattoo.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Ink Well Tattoo">Ink Well Tattoo</A>   |   <B>Neuvation R 28 SL 2</B>   |   <A HREF="ritchey_fork.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Ritchey Comp Carbon Road Fork">Ritchey Comp Carbon Road Fork</A>   |   <A HREF="vredestein_se_road_tires.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Vredestein SE Road Tires">Vredestein SE Road Tires</A></div> <div> </div> </td> </tr><tr> <td valign="top" width=210 BGCOLOR="#000000" TEXT="#F7F7FF" background="006d2b83.jpg"> <div> <IMG SRC="23eafa00.gif" border=0 width="175" height="160" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></div> <div> <I><B>Serious cyclists having serious fun!</B></I></div> <div> Big Ring Adventure Team</div> <div> A Division of 53T, Inc.</div> <div> P.O. 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When I e-mail a question, he answers quickly, completely and - best of all - honestly. I don't get that kind of attention from every manufacturer, not even other small players like John. It's hard to quantify the value of this quality, but it certainly makes me feel good about my decision to buy Neuvation wheels.</div> <div> <B><IMG SRC="30c0bc80.jpg" border=0 width="267" height="200" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></B></div> <div> <B>Update August 2007: </B>Cracks at the rim were discovered during a routine inspection. There were about a dozen points of failure, all at the spoke holes. We notified John Neugent of the problem and and he had a reconditioned wheel on its way to us within 48 hours via FedEx ground. Six days later the wheel was on the bike. We're a little bummed to have had problems with what have otherwise been reliable wheels, but we're impressed by John's quick, efficient handling of the situation. The failed wheel is FedExing its way back to John (ground service again). We'll share any insights he shares on the cause of failure. Byron's rear wheel exhibited similar, but smaller fractures and was also replaced at no charge.</div> <div> <B>Previous Updates:</B> click <A HREF="#spoke_tension_issues" TITLE="Neuvation R 28 SL 2">here</A><A HREF="#spoke_tension_issues" TITLE="Neuvation R 28 SL 2"> </A>to get to information on spoke tensions problems with Rich's rear wheel. Click <A HREF="#byron_s_wheels" TITLE="Neuvation R 28 SL 2">here</A><A HREF="#byron_s_wheels" TITLE="Neuvation R 28 SL 2"> </A>to get to info on Byron Nagel's Neuvation wheels.</div> <div> <B>Product:</B> Neuvation R 28 SL2 road wheelset.</div> <div> <B>Date of Review:</B> August 2006; updated May 2007 and again in August 2007.</div> <div> <B>Reviewed by:</B> Rich Ries.</div> <div> <B>Cost:</B> $499 MSRP; typically on sale from the manufacturer for $399. I paid $299 from the manufacturer's overstock sale.</div> <div> <B>Weight:</B> See below.</div> <div> <B>Configuration:</B> 20 spoke front; 24 spoke rear; one-cross throughout; double-butted stainless steel spokes. Nipples are alloy except on drive-side rear where brass nipples are used for improved reliability.</div> <div> <B>Source:</B> Purchased from Neuvation Cycling.</div> <div> <B>More info:</B> Neuvation Cycling <A HREF="http://www.neuvationcycling.com/" TARGET="_blank" TITLE="http://www.neuvationcycling.com/">Web site</A>.</div> <div> <B>Recommended?:</B> Yes, if cost is your main consideration. However, if you watch the sales you can likely get a set of wheels with similar specs but greater reliability for around the same price.</div> <div> <TABLE BORDER="2" CELLPADDING="2" CELLSPACING="1" WIDTH="563" BORDERCOLORLIGHT="#C0C0C0" BORDERCOLORDARK="#808080" FRAME="BOX" RULES="ALL" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" > <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER COLSPAN=2 HEIGHT= 38 ><NOBR><div> Ratings</div> <div> (1 is lowest, 5 is highest)</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Comments</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 19 WIDTH="148"><div> Comfort</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 4</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER><NOBR><div> Almost plush despite the semi-aero rim</div> </NOBR></tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Stiffness</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 4</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Minimally affected by pavement seams, grooves, debris, ridges, etc.</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Cornering</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 5</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Plenty predictable, although I don't corner as aggressively as I once did</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Braking, dry conditions</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 4</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER><NOBR><div> Machined braking surface really helps</div> </NOBR></tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Braking, wet conditions</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 4</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Machining helps here, too</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Weight</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 3</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Lots of lightweight wheels out there these days; see additional notes in text</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Ease of Installation</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 5</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER><NOBR><div> Nicely packaged; fully assembled</div> </NOBR></tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Serviceability</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 4</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Downloadable service instructions; a welcome lack of proprietary parts</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Cost/Value</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 4</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Even at $399; this is subject to change as we get more miles on these wheels</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 WIDTH="148"><div> Style</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 4</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Classy graphics. Some color would break up all that silver.</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=CENTER HEIGHT= 38 ><NOBR><div> Service, Support</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="61"><div> 5</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=CENTER WIDTH="328"><div> Accurate, immediate answers to e-mail inquiries</div> </tD> </tR> </TABLE></div> <div> Although my old wheels were still serviceable, the rear hub had some bearing race damage on the non-drive side that would have been difficult or impossible to repair. That and a desire for some lighter wheels drove my decision to buy new wheels. Neuvations were on my short list.</div> <div> I first met John Neugent at Interbike in 2004 and was impressed by his candor and commitment to building great wheels. He promised to send me a set for review, but despite some gentle reminders the wheels never arrived. I suppose a few sets have to visit many editors, and BRAT doesn't place high on the priority list despite our 50k site hits each month.</div> <div> When I found the wheels on sale, I decided to take the plunge and order a set without ever having ridden them. At three bills for a pair, this isn't a huge risk. But good wheels often go on sale, so there was a minor leap of faith in assuming that these would be a better choice than something from, say, Cane Creek.</div> <div> [My first experience with lightweight, low-spoke count wheels involved Cronometro wheels, which were provided to me by the inventor before he sold the design to Cane Creek. Cane Creek renamed the wheels “Crono;” the current iteration is the Strados. Those Cronometro wheels offered incredible performance and remain the benchmark by which I judge other wheels. Click here to get to the Road Wheels section of the Cane Creek Web site.]</div> <div> The Neuvation wheels arrived within a week and the first thing I noticed was that they were well packaged. The courier services around here are in a competition to see who can cause the greatest damage to the greatest number of packages, but the Neuvation box was intact. The wheels were well protected inside the box with heavy cardboard holders and plastic caps on the hub ends.</div> <div> Taped to the top of the cardboard holders were two skewers. The skewers were pretty and they operated smoothly, but they weighed quite a bit more than the old Salsa skewers I'd been using. The new skewers went on the bench and the old skewers went on the bike.</div> <div> Also taped in place was bag with six replacement spokes, two each for the front wheel and the drive- and non-drive side rear. Neuvation wheels are built with Pillar stainless spokes, which are thicker at the ends (2.3 mm instead of 2.0 mm) to resist breaking. Getting extras is a nice touch.</div> <div> <B>A Word About Weight</B></div> <div> The wheels are noticeably lighter than the wheels I had, but not as light as the Neuvation Web site promised. My old wheels were 32-hole, 3-cross, built with DT Swiss 2.0 mm stainless spokes and brass nipples and used Velox rim strips. Hubs and rims were from 1995. The front hub was a Shimano 105; the rear was a Shimano 600 (renamed Ultegra in later years). The front rim was a Mavic MA2 and the rear was a Sun CRT16II.</div> <div> Here's the weight matrix (all weights in grams using a digital scale; wheel weights include rim tape):</div> <div> <TABLE BORDER="2" CELLPADDING="2" CELLSPACING="1" WIDTH="403" BORDERCOLORLIGHT="#C0C0C0" BORDERCOLORDARK="#808080" FRAME="BOX" RULES="ALL" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" > <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 WIDTH="108"><div> Item</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP><NOBR><div> Weight of old part</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP><NOBR><div> Weight of new part</div> </NOBR></tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Front skewer</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 42</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 57</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Rear skewer</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 45</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 61</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Front wheel</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 892</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 711</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Rear wheel</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 1,137</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 900</div> </tD> </tR> </TABLE></div> <div> By re-using my old skewers I was able to build up a set of wheel weighing 1,698 grams or 1,611 grams without skewers but with rim strips in place. But the Neuvation site says the wheels should weigh 1,530 grams sans skewers and rim strips. There is this disclaimer on the site:</div> <div> <B>Note on wheel weights</B><FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000" FACE="Arial" >: Wheel weights vary due to the extruded rim. As the extrusion gets older the rims weigh more. The hubs in this set are actually lighter than the hubs in the previous R28 SL but the rims have gained more than that in weight. The wheels that ship under this model number could be a light as 1450 grams to as heavy as 1550 grams and I am sorry but I cannot open and check boxes to weigh wheels. This is an unavoidable fact of alloy rim product that other companies do not mention.</FONT></div> <div> I sent John an e-mail about this and here is his reply:</div> <div> The rim strips are about 30 grams or so which puts them in at about 1580. There is still that much variation. Believe it or not, the first set I weighed actually came in at 1440 grams.  The only good news about it is that it makes the rim stronger since it's a little thicker.</div> <div> If you were to go and weigh other wheel makers' wheels you would find something very similar.</div> <div> My experience with claimed weights vs. actual weights on all bicycle components confirms John's observation. Dedicated weight weenies should invest in a digital scale and be psychologically prepared for the letdown they get when they use it.</div> <div> <B>First Impressions</B></div> <div> I installed these wheels the Friday afternoon that they arrived and put a little more than a hundred miles on them over the following weekend. It was a nice mix of stout climbs, long flat stretches, rollers, high-speed descents, and sprints over pavement that varied from truly wonderful to utterly horrifying. The only thing I didn't experience (thankfully) was wet weather.</div> <div> If there's a characteristic that stands out about these wheels it's that nothing stands out. They're reasonably light, reasonably stiff, and they perform predictably in all conditions. No big surprises, good or bad. Just competence everywhere.</div> <div> Vertical compliance was better than I expected; the ride was much more comfortable than it had been with my old wheels. Yet the Neuvations were laterally stiff and tracked well over pavement irregularities and through turns with no noticeable brake rub during hard cornering or sprinting. Braking was much improved over my old wheels, but I'd expect that in going from smooth braking surfaces to machined surfaces.</div> <div> I'm just under 5' 11” and just over 180 pounds right now. My riding style is moderately aggressive. Your experience with Neuvation wheels may be different from mine depending on your specifications.</div> <div> I also noticed that hub engagement was very quick. I asked John Neugent if there was something unique about the design of the hub. His response:</div> <div> It's actually a Taiwan copy (from what I can tell) of a White [Industries] hub.  It has three pawls.</div> <div> Nothing unusual there. Three pawls are standard. But the White Industries knockoff design explains a lot. I have authentic White Industries hubs on my full suspension mountain bike and the rear has the same quick, solid feel as the hub on the Neuvation road wheel.</div> <div> <B> <A NAME="spoke_tension_issues"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></B><B>Spoke Tension Issues</B></div> <div> With a couple of hundred miles on these wheels I noticed that the rear had come out of true. It seemed that the spoke tension on the non-drive side was too low. I e-mailed John and he said that a recent wheel shipment had this problem. Even so, he said his spoke-related warranty claims were no more than one percent.</div> <div> I had already trued the wheel, but after my e-mail exchange with John I went back and re-tensioned the rear wheel using a Wheelsmith spoke tensiometer. I'll let you know if there are any further problems.</div> <div> Update - with several thousand additional miles on these wheels, they've not required another truing.</div> <div> <B>Serviceability</B></div> <div> I do all my own work on every bike I own. I ride more than 6,000 miles a year, so repair and preventive maintenance (PM) procedures come up often. I want components that are easy to service and require no manufacturer-specific specialty tools. I also want clear and concise service instructions. Neuvation wheels qualify on all counts.</div> <div> My only concern is that John Neugent recommends fairly frequent servicing of the rear hub:</div> <div> The bearings don't need to be serviced because they are sealed (as long as you don't blow all of the lubricant out of them with a power washer).  The pawls are really easy to get to and I would recommend doing this every few thousand miles until you get an idea of how quickly you get them dirty (some people are worse than others).</div> <div> That's not excessive PM. The schedule is probably no different than what Shimano recommended for the 600/Ultegra hub I had been riding. But I didn't adhere to Shimano's recommendations very well and chances are this hub won't get any better treatment. With luck I'll get 30,000+ miles out of this hub anyway, as I did the Shimano unit.</div> <div> And at least the hub can be serviced. I cooked a set of Formula Xero wheels in a single season. The design was such that rebuilding the rear hub wasn't practical so I chose to go back to a set of wheels I had hanging in the garage.</div> <div> I'll update this section when I service the Neuvation wheels.</div> <div> <B> <A NAME="byron_s_wheels"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></B><B>Byron's Wheels</B></div> <div> Soon after I got my set of wheels another Big Ringer, Byron Nagel, discovered he needed replacements for the Bontrager Race Lites that came on his Trek. The `tragers had fractures around the eyelets. Not an indictment of those wheels. Byron's a big guy and rides a lot of hard miles over rough roads. He figured he had maybe 10,000 miles on those OEM wheels.</div> <div> Byron ordered a set of Neuvations. When the wheels arrived he came over to BRAT World Headquarters and we installed them. The weights were nearly identical to my wheels.</div> <div> <TABLE BORDER="2" CELLPADDING="2" CELLSPACING="1" WIDTH="403" BORDERCOLORLIGHT="#C0C0C0" BORDERCOLORDARK="#808080" FRAME="BOX" RULES="ALL" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" > <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 WIDTH="108"><div> Byron's Item</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP><NOBR><div> Weight of old part</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP><NOBR><div> Weight of new part</div> </NOBR></tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Front skewer</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 50</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 57</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Rear skewer</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 55</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 62</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Front wheel</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 740</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 706</div> </tD> </tR> <tR> <tD VALIGN=TOP HEIGHT= 19 ><NOBR><div> Rear wheel</div> </NOBR></tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="129"><div> 1,039</div> </tD> <tD VALIGN=TOP WIDTH="140"><div> 906</div> </tD> </tR> </TABLE></div> <div> It's interesting to note that the <FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#FF0000" FACE="Arial" ><B>Bontrager Web site</B></FONT> lists the weight for this wheelset as 1,690 grams. Byron's wheels weighed 1,779 g. It's possible the current Race Lites are lighter than those that came on Byron's bike. It's also possible - and more likely - that the discrepancy gives credence to John Neugent's assertion that all manufacturers understate the weights of their components.</div> <div> My wheels were true enough out of the box to not require further work, with less than two millimeters lateral runout and no measurable radial deviation. Byron's wheels were even closer to perfectly true. The non-drive rear had better spoke tension than mine did. We'll keep an eye on it, but I don't expect he'll have any problems.</div> <div> After his first 30 miles on these wheels, Byron reports that the climbing, turning and braking are on par with or slightly better than his old wheels, but that the ride quality is noticeably improved. "They're a little more supple than what I had," he said.</div> <div> <B>Noise Problems</B></div> <div> Soon after we got our wheels, Byron and I both noticed the rear wheels would squawk under power. I e-mailed John Neugent about this and he said his supplier had lubed the pawls on some wheels with grease that was out of spec. It was too stiff. John said the fix was to take apart the hub, clean out the stiff grease and apply some thinner grease. Byron had St. Matthews Schwinn in Louisville do the work while they were doing some other stuff for him. Several months later I did the work on my wheels. The hubs are easier to service than any I've ever worked on, and applying thinner grease did the trick. No more squawking for either of us. (I used Park Polylube. I don't know what St. Matthews used.)</div> <div> <B><U>Photos</U></B></div> <div> <IMG SRC="16d8a270.jpg" border=0 width="650" height="551" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></div> <div> The Neuvation wheels aren't radical, with stainless round spokes, alloy nipples (brass nipples on the drive-side rear) at the rim instead of the hub, one-cross lacing pattern, semi-aero rims and machined braking surfaces. But it's an effective design and one that can be produced at low cost.</div> <div> <IMG SRC="16f8ac20.jpg" border=0 width="650" height="450" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></div> <div> Flanges are sculpted to remove excess material and save weight.</div> <div> <IMG SRC="1718a510.jpg" border=0 width="650" height="593" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></div> <div> The Pillar spokes can be identified by the "P" stamped on their heads.</div> <div> <IMG SRC="173508a0.jpg" border=0 width="592" height="650" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></div> <div> Pillar spokes are double butted, swelling from 2.0 to 2.3 mm on the ends, to resist breaking.</div> <div> <IMG SRC="1768ae80.jpg" border=0 width="650" height="488" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></div> <div> The rear hub was extremely easy to service.</div> </td> </tr></table></body>